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hans45
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Posted: Thu Mar 6th, 2008 05:55 pm |
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I have read that 40% of American males have a porn addiction. Now, I know we all call this an addiction but is it really? Maybe it's just a filthy sinful habit. Not an addiction. Crack addicts and heroin users kill for their addictions. Would porn users kill for their habit? If someone offered a so called porn addict one thousand dollars a week to stop using porn, how many would be instantly cured? The same offer to the crack addict or heroin user would not work ever.
So, maybe we are calling ourselves addicts but in reality we are merely indulging in sinful habits. A very strong one indeed and hard to overcome. What are your thoughts?
Dennis
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Journey
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Posted: Thu Mar 6th, 2008 06:05 pm |
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Well, what do I know about anything, but I can't resist when someone asks what I think about something. 
I think you could be right about some people just indulging in sinful habits. Perhaps we, looking on the outward appearance, cannot tell. I thought indugence was the case with my particular issues for many years. It wasn't until God began to shine His light, and I began to listen and truly try to change, that I found out what a hold sexual addiction has on me. And found out that I fit the descriptions of an addict. I was powerless to change. But before that, who could have told whether it was an addiction, or just wrong choices?
Journey
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Wilderness Voice
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Posted: Thu Mar 6th, 2008 06:15 pm |
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One does become an addict; but it doesn't make it any less than a choice to sin. All kinds of sins are addictive. It doesn't make them not a sin because they have an addictive property.
Romans 6:
12] Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.
[13] Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.
[14] For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.
[15] What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
[16] Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
[17] But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.
[18] Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.
[19] I speak after the manner of men because of the infirmity of your flesh: for as ye have yielded your members servants to uncleanness and to iniquity unto iniquity; even so now yield your members servants to righteousness unto holiness.
[20] For when ye were the servants of sin, ye were free from righteousness.
These scriptures reveal much:
From [12]: if you're sinning, you're obeying lusts.
From [13]: if your sinning, you're yielding your members as instruments of unrighteousness.
From [14]: if you were under grace; sin would not have dominion over you; if sin has dominion over you - you are not under grace
From [15]:if we are sinning; we are doing what God forbids.
From [16]:if we yield ourselves to sin; we are a servant of death.
From [17]:if you are sinning; you have not obeyed from the heart the doctrine delivered to you.
From [18]:if you are not free from sin; you are not the servant of righteousness.
From [19]:if you are not yielding your members as servants to righteousness unto holiness; you are yielding your members as servants to uncleaness and to iniquity unto iniquity.
From [20]:if you are a servant of sin; you are free from righteousness.
These are hard sayings. Who can hear them? It is easy to read these scriptures and many others like them and not really hear what they are saying. And when we don't really hear - we don't receive the Word of God that causes the substance of faith to grow. That is why we can read or listen at the surface to the Bible and its truth does not penetrate or cause us to be free. We don't actually know what it said because we didn't hear. The pleasure of unrighteousness causes this affect in us, that we don't receive a love for the truth and therefore don't really hear it.
But if we listen closely - and repent - the truth shall make us free.
More or less agreeing with you Hans45.
Wilderness Voice
God does have pity on those in bondage. But He has a mighty arm of deliverance and mercy and truth are met together.
Last edited on Thu Mar 6th, 2008 06:29 pm by Wilderness Voice
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guitarist63
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Posted: Thu Mar 6th, 2008 10:35 pm |
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WV has stated it as I would - it's both. Emphasis, however, on sin and not addiction. Otherwise, one might make exuses for one's behaviour and say, "I can't help it because I am an addict" whereas we can help it because sin is our choice to do what is contrary to God's will.
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bil4913
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Posted: Fri Mar 7th, 2008 03:09 pm |
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FWIW, I've spent a lot of time and thought on this issue. To help me understand myself, I'm using these working definitions.
Addiction: Anything (good or bad) that I use badly to meet a good need instead of God (A GOD SUBSTITUTE) that has reached the point where I can't stop even though I want to and/or it no longer works.
I would further say that all addiction is both sin and sickness. Sin - in that it is caused by my choicing to meet (or attempt to meet) my own needs and putting something (or someone) else before God. Sickness - in that it requires treatment (recovery) just as the long-term cigarette smoker needs treatment for his/her cancer.
BUT.....I would not say that all sin is addiction. Not all sexual sin is addiction. But when an action becomes something I cannot stop doing even though I want to, we're probably looking at addiction. I challenge the criteria that willingness to kill is evidence of addiction. Few cigarette, lottery, gossip, or shopping addicts are likely to become murderers. But they're addicts.
So, yes, Deniis, we are indulging in sinful habits. Addictively.
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hans45
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Posted: Fri Mar 7th, 2008 03:54 pm |
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bil4913 wrote: FWIW, I've spent a lot of time and thought on this issue. To help me understand myself, I'm using these working definitions.
Addiction: Anything (good or bad) that I use badly to meet a good need instead of God (A GOD SUBSTITUTE) that has reached the point where I can't stop even though I want to and/or it no longer works.
I would further say that all addiction is both sin and sickness. Sin - in that it is caused by my choicing to meet (or attempt to meet) my own needs and putting something (or someone) else before God. Sickness - in that it requires treatment (recovery) just as the long-term cigarette smoker needs treatment for his/her cancer.
BUT.....I would not say that all sin is addiction. Not all sexual sin is addiction. But when an action becomes something I cannot stop doing even though I want to, we're probably looking at addiction. I challenge the criteria that willingness to kill is evidence of addiction. Few cigarette, lottery, gossip, or shopping addicts are likely to become murderers. But they're addicts.
So, yes, Deniis, we are indulging in sinful habits. Addictively.
You are right. Not all addictions lead one to commit murder. But the point I was trying to make was that being a porn addict may be one that is easily overcome. Like the example of the money offered. I will depend on God for my strength but some may not. Of course no one in their right mind would offer money for that.
Dennis
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TimM
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Posted: Sun Apr 20th, 2008 01:09 am |
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hans45 wrote: But the point I was trying to make was that being a porn addict may be one that is easily overcome.
If that has been your experience, wonderful! For me and for lots of people I know, that isn't how it has worked. Or at least, I know many people who have found recovery from alcoholism easier than recovery from sex addiction, and smaller numbers who have gotten sober from cocaine or other drugs more easily than from porn.
It's great if your experience differs from mine, but I spent a lot of years making no progress in part because I was underestimating badly the gravity of my situation.
Just how it's been for me, of course.
Tim M.
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hans45
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Posted: Sun Apr 20th, 2008 01:52 pm |
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Good morning TimM,
You're absolutely right, we are all different. Just like you and a lot of others I fought and struggled with sex addiction for thirty years or more. It seemed like it was totally beyond repair until one day it hit me up side the head like a ton of bricks. When I say it, I'm speaking of God as that ton of bricks. I can't explain why after that many years my heart changed. All I know is, that it did and God did it. The teptation to return to it is still alive and well but I deal with it, when those urges come, in a much different way. God bless you Tim and you are in my prayers.
Dennis
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Paulos
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Posted: Mon Apr 21st, 2008 06:57 pm |
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Welcome back, TimM!
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Man
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Posted: Mon Apr 21st, 2008 08:31 pm |
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Nice to see you again TimM!!
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Man
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Posted: Mon Apr 21st, 2008 08:44 pm |
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Wilderness Voice wrote: One does become an addict; but it doesn't make it any less than a choice to sin. All kinds of sins are addictive. It doesn't make them not a sin because they have an addictive property.
Romans 6:
12] Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.
[13] Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.
[14] For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.
[15] What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
[16] Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
[17] But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.
[18] Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.
[19] I speak after the manner of men because of the infirmity of your flesh: for as ye have yielded your members servants to uncleanness and to iniquity unto iniquity; even so now yield your members servants to righteousness unto holiness.
[20] For when ye were the servants of sin, ye were free from righteousness.
These scriptures reveal much:
From [12]: if you're sinning, you're obeying lusts.
From [13]: if your sinning, you're yielding your members as instruments of unrighteousness.
From [14]: if you were under grace; sin would not have dominion over you; if sin has dominion over you - you are not under grace
From [15]:if we are sinning; we are doing what God forbids.
From [16]:if we yield ourselves to sin; we are a servant of death.
From [17]:if you are sinning; you have not obeyed from the heart the doctrine delivered to you.
From [18]:if you are not free from sin; you are not the servant of righteousness.
From [19]:if you are not yielding your members as servants to righteousness unto holiness; you are yielding your members as servants to uncleaness and to iniquity unto iniquity.
From [20]:if you are a servant of sin; you are free from righteousness.
These are hard sayings. Who can hear them? It is easy to read these scriptures and many others like them and not really hear what they are saying. And when we don't really hear - we don't receive the Word of God that causes the substance of faith to grow. That is why we can read or listen at the surface to the Bible and its truth does not penetrate or cause us to be free. We don't actually know what it said because we didn't hear. The pleasure of unrighteousness causes this affect in us, that we don't receive a love for the truth and therefore don't really hear it.
But if we listen closely - and repent - the truth shall make us free.
More or less agreeing with you Hans45.
Wilderness Voice
God does have pity on those in bondage. But He has a mighty arm of deliverance and mercy and truth are met together.
Wilderness Voice: Are you free? Are you experiencing all this in your own life? Be blessed
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