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Melissa
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Posted: Fri Apr 20th, 2007 08:04 am |
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I just discovered this site and am glad I did. Sorry in advance for all the boring details, but they are needed to see the full picture.
My husband and I started dating right before I turned 17 and he turned 16. We were both "Christians", or at least thought we were. In fact, he went to a Private Christian school. Unfortunately we did have a pre-marital sexual relationship. It resulted in a pregnancy that ended in a still born 7 months later. That was tough to go through, but we stuck together and grew closer. 2 months later my family moved 2 states away. We had a long distance relationship and saw each other twice in 5 months. All of a sudden he dropped a bomb on me by calling me sobbing and confessing that he had cheated on me with a co-worker. We were engaged at the time and my world just collapsed. For a while he grew distant and I thought it was over, but then he decided that he wanted to work it out. Problem is that I found out he had lied several times about various details. He was sufficiently remorseful and willing to be accountable to me so we stayed together. A couple months later he followed me to my new state and 5 months later we were married (19 and 18).
He knew my position on Adultery. I made it clear that he had already been forgiven once...any infidelity would result in a divorce. Early in the marriage we did watch some porn together and by ourselves. Our marriage was typical...a little rocky the first few years, but I eventually started to trust him again. I became pregnant shortly after our 3 year anniversary. We worked opposite shifts so didn't see each other much. Our sexual relationship suffered because we were both to selfish and stubborn to bend to what the other wanted. I was having women's intuition that he was having an affair, but I kept denying it to myself. I did ask him point blank once and he (of course) denied it. Our son was born and things settled into a routine. 5 months later I had my annual exam and had an abnormal pap. I told him, "if there is anything I need to know, you better tell me now. I will be very upset if I have to find out from the Dr." He continued to deny it, but then all of a sudden tearfully confessed that he had indeed had an affair while I was pregnant (went on for 5 months) and that she had told him she might have genital warts. Again, I was devestated and felt bereft. At first I tried to deal with it on my own, but eventually confided in my Mom. Through the healing process my probing would reveal another lie that he had told me. We went to a marriage counselor (non-Christian) and it did not help at all. We went to a Pastor and he made me furious (his view was that I should forgive and move on). For the sake of my son, and because I do love him, I decided to make my marriage work. About that time I realized that I was not truly saved and I accepted Jesus as my Savior. My husband went to church with me and still continued to profess that he was saved (from way back when he was a kid) but he did not bear witness to the fact whatsoever.
Of course, now that I was saved I realized that porn was adultery and wrong. I explained my views to my husband. He didn't necessarily agree, but he said he would give it up. I through out all the videos. Occasionally I would ask him if he was viewing sites on his computer and he sometimes said yes, so I patiently explained my position again and continued to ask him to stop. At one point I finally drew the line in the sand and told him it definitely had to stop and if I caught him doing it again I would consider it as an infidelity and leave him. I also explained that I would not tolerate lies anymore. A couple of years later I discovered how to view Internet cookies and found out that he was still engaging in porn, and quite often. I confronted him with it and he at first tried to deny it, and then admitted it but lied about details and then finally came clean. He can lie with absolutely no effort and no detection. He cried and begged me not to leave him and promised he would stop. By this time I had 3 kids, so I gave in. Unfortunately this scenario was repeated several times with the same result. He admitted he had a problem and promised to seek help, but never followed through. The past year or so I have been unable to check up on him because he figured out how to delete the cookies, but he has maintained that he hasn't been using any porn. I hit 30 and our sex life improved and things have been going very well. Until today. I walked in to find him masterbating in front of his laptop. I knew right away that it had to have porn on it. He insisted that this was the 1st time it had happened in a LONG time and that he had stumbled on the site when he clicked on a link that had been sent to him in an e-mail. Of course he was lying again and finally admitted that he had been doing it for at least a week. I have told him that it is over. If I cannot trust him to stay mentally/emotionally/spiritually faithful, then how can I trust him to stay physically faithful when he goes on business trips? Due to a lot of circumstances, some financial, I am letting him stay at the house but have told him that it will be a marriage in name only. I have forgiven him too many times. He swears that he will follow through and get counseling this time and do whatever it takes to save the marriage. He said it had nothing to do with our sex life. He has been feeling down and it made him "feel better". I told him how disgusting that thought was. I also explained that I can never trust him again because there is no accountability since he uses his laptop and deletes the cookies (although through this site I have discovered 'Covenant Eyes'. I honestly don't believe he is a Christian and have approached him numerous times about it, but he gets upset with me, or tries to show me (for a short time) that he is one. I feel like such a fool (keep on getting kicked but keep on coming back for more!) but I do love him.
What should I do? Should I be supportive as he works through his sex addiction issues and ensure he follows up with counseling this time? Or do I say enough is enough and end it? Again, we have 3 kids and have been married for 12 years. I hate that he has put me in this position, especially when things seemed to be going so well.
If you have read this, thank you. I'm so sorry it was so long. I'm sure getting it off my chest has been somewhat healing. I appreciate any thoughts.
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truthseeker
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Posted: Fri Apr 20th, 2007 03:51 pm |
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Hi Melissa,
As you may have read in some of the posts, there are men who, finally, after decades have hit rock bottom and, after many previous promises, are finally taking recovery seriously. You have probably also read of wives who are dealing with this after so many years. So it is impossible for any of us to know if this time is his rock bottom, though we can hope and pray to that effect. If literally separating is not an option, as you indicate, your idea of virtual separation may help. You might even consider withdrawing not just physically, but also make it clear that were you to divorce he would have to be doing X Y and Z for himself, so he should start doing some things for himself, perhaps laundry, ironing, etc. You might again wish to be tested, and have him tested, for STD's, and, should the relationship get back to that point, use protection until six months later and both be tested again. Steps he needs to take include individual counselling, attending an SA recovery group, and getting accountability partners. SafeEyes is another good accountability program, but they are just a bandaid for the behavior.
The sad thing is, that if he is feeling down, he should be coming to the Lord with that, and/or you. While I grant that the Bible says that by their fruit ye shall know them, it is probably not productive to assess his salvation, though it is fine, as lovingly as possible, to show him in the Bible where he is not being obedient. Just be prepared for him to do the same. Will he pray and read the Bible with you? I hope that you are attending a different church at this point than the one whose pastor told you to forgive and stick your head in the sand. As you met so young, do you have any idea what might be roots of this in his childhood, especially any family difficulties? Is there anything that can be done to curtail business trips for now? Don't let him play the "if you'll make appointments and get all the information, I will go" game. He needs to own responsibility for his sin and personally take the necessary steps to recover. Hopefully he is finally realizing that the macho "I can fix this through my willlpower" routine is not working.
Praying for you both....
TruthSeeker
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Suzi
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Posted: Fri Apr 20th, 2007 04:53 pm |
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Hi Melissa,
I am so sorry you need to be here, but glad that this is finally reached the point where you KNOW that this issue has not gone away. Knowing the worst is better than being in the dark, in my opinion.
Please insist that he get counseling... you may need to try a couple before you find one who will be able to get to the root of his problem. Also, I would put expectations on him to find an accountability partner, at the least... A group would be better. He needs someone who will hold his feet to the fire and care enough about him to meet with him and pray with him.
Unfortunately, if it isn't really something he WANTS to do... I know of no way to MAKE somebody else clean up their lives. Pray for wisdom in this "house separation". I think that would be a difficult thing to maintain.
It seems to me that the quickest way to a true wakeup call is the loss of the fantasy... in other words, exposure. And then having to face what this sin is or can cost you. He needs to know that there are at least a FEW people who know the truth and he needs to know what this continued behavior will cost him. What will it feel like for him to lose you? Your family? He needs to consider these consequences.
My biggest prayer for you, Melissa, is that you will daily be able to determine in your heart what is God's will for you TODAY! What is it that God wants you to do? Crawl up on your Heavenly Father's lap and receive the love, the concern, and the care for you needs for today. Listen to HIM.... and just take it a day at a time.
As a wife, I fight the struggle to "fix" my husband on a daily basis. What I have found is I cannot FIX him... he has to want it for himself. I am only responsible being in the center of God's will for myself. To this point, for me, it's been to stay. But I never take that for granted. GOD knows my H's heart... and I am trusting God to show me what I need to do.
Sorry this is getting long. But I have lived this for 11 years now (porn addiction, multiple infidelities)... and although we are working on the marriage, it really isn't all that easy, even now. But I know ONE thing... this has brought me closer to God than I have ever been in my entire life. So it's kind of a two-edged sword. I NOW know just how much God, my Father, loves me... and HE has always been faithful, even when my earthly relationships have held the sting of betrayal. But then... who besides our Lord would understand betrayal better than we?
Hang on to Jesus, Melissa... and let Him guide you. Just take it moment by moment, day by day. And if God directs you to leave your H, know that HE will be the Husband of the husbandless and the Father of the fatherless.
If you don't already have a trustworthy woman friend to turn to, pray that God will direct you to a godly woman who can be there for you, someone who will faithfully pray for you, and help you in the times of doubt and crisis. Pray for a godly man who will step up and do the same for your husband.
And finally, pray FOR your husband. I found so many of my prayers were ABOUT my H.. (Lord, will you please DO something about him!!!). Well, instead, I try to simply pray specifically for my H as my brother in Christ... if this were simply another Christian brother, how would I pray for him? Sometimes I have to take the "wife" hat off, and put on the "sister" hat. If your H is a believer, then he is also your brother. That may seem weird... but really, it has helped me more to detach my "wifeness" from the issues and see this as a SIN problem!! Not simply a marriage problem.
Melissa, please know I will pray for you, and pray that you will get the answers and support you need.
God Bless You!
Suzi
____________________
Psa 107:20 He sent his word, and healed them, and delivered them from their destructions.
Luke 6:46 And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?
Psa 119:37 Turn away mine eyes from beholding vanity; and quicken thou me in thy way.
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Melissa
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Posted: Sat Apr 21st, 2007 04:06 am |
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Thank you so much for your reply. Yes, there are definitely family issues. Plus a family history of adultery (at least 3rd generation on his father's side).
I so appreciate your prayers and would love if they could continue. 
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Melissa
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Posted: Sat Apr 21st, 2007 04:15 am |
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Suzi,
I also appreciate your reply. It is so reassuring to find this site and see that other women are facing the same issues. In regards to your question about finding a Christian woman to share this with. The only one I feel comfortable with is my Mom, but she has a tendancy to share with other family members and she also lets things cloud her view of my H, which makes their strained relationship worse.
This evening we had a LONG talk. We candidly discussed some issues that we have failed to tackle in the past. Like so many other posts that I've seen, he described it as a "mind numbing habit" and doesn't quite know why he does it or returns to it. But he does agree it is a problem. I suggested he try numbing his brain with video games instead.
He is a very closed, anti-social person and does not deal well with people. He has agreed to seek out one on one counseling, but doesn't feel he could do a group. I saw that this site has an "Accountability" forum. He said he will use it.
We reconnected emotionally, but he understands that the physical aspect will be long in coming. I have to learn to trust him yet again.
Thanks again for taking the time to respond and for your prayers. I would appreciate continued prayers!
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Suzi
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Posted: Sat Apr 21st, 2007 04:37 am |
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Melissa,
It's good to hear of some progress and some emotional connection being made.
As far as finding a godly woman, it's awesome that your mother is that in your life! What a wonderful heritage! However, as a mom and a mother-in-law, I am wondering just how objective I would be if my daughter was in this situation. Surely I want her to come to me with her problems, and I would be honored for her to trust me with this. However, I am not sure I really want to know as much intimacy about her and her H's relaltionship, more as a protection for our future relationship as inlaws. Know what I mean? Certainly you are fortunate to have your mother as a confidant, but I will still pray that another woman who wouldn't be so closely associated in your family would become available to you as a good friend.
This has been hard to put into words... So I hope you understand that this is not a negative thing about your mother. I just know that as much as I love my daughter and my son-in-law and feel like I would give my life for them, I am not so certain it is best for me to know ALL about their problems. My daughter, fortunately, has several very godly women her own age who are good friends with her. I pray this could happen for you, too!
Suzi
____________________
Psa 107:20 He sent his word, and healed them, and delivered them from their destructions.
Luke 6:46 And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?
Psa 119:37 Turn away mine eyes from beholding vanity; and quicken thou me in thy way.
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gaylon
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Posted: Sat Apr 21st, 2007 05:10 am |
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Suzi wrote: ...some emotional connection being made... Sorry to break the thread up some, but could someone help me with what an "emotional connection" means? All women seem to understand this term, and know when they're having it with their husbands, but, I guarantee you, 99% of men have very little idea what their wife wants and needs when she says she wants to be connected "emotionally and spiritually". The words imply talking about feelings and reading scripture, but, what is it that a woman really wants when she wants those things? I have discussed this with my wife, read books about it, but still don't understand it... Maybe it's just a male obtuseness that we have to live with...
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Suzi
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Posted: Sat Apr 21st, 2007 05:40 am |
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LOL!!
Well, the best way I can describe it is this...
When I FEEL like my husband has not just listened to what I said, but that he HEARD it with his heart. When he takes it beyond fact and communicates with me in such a way that I know he understands my point of view and the motives behind what I am saying. And when he is willing to share his inner feelings and motive with me! When he trusts ME with what is going on in his mind and his heart... Now... that is connecting emotonally in my book.
Yeah, it's kind of a male/female thing... But it's IMPORTANT!
Ever heard of Eggerich's book Trust and Respect? I haven't read but have heard our pastor preach about the application of it regarding marriage. He says that women need WORDS and men need SEX to feel intimate.
One example our pastor gave recently to drive it home is this... he said here are two words for a woman who has sex with a man who doesn't share what's in his heart... whore and prostitute. When a man doesn't open up his heart to his wife, but expects sex anyway, it makes his wfe feel like a prostitute. Does that help?
Suzi
Last edited on Sat Apr 21st, 2007 05:42 am by Suzi
____________________
Psa 107:20 He sent his word, and healed them, and delivered them from their destructions.
Luke 6:46 And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?
Psa 119:37 Turn away mine eyes from beholding vanity; and quicken thou me in thy way.
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Melissa
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Posted: Sat Apr 21st, 2007 03:11 pm |
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Thank you again Suzi! I completely understand what you are sayind. A mother can't help but have negative feelings about anyone who hurts their "baby". You are right about me being fortunate to have a godly mother...she wasn't always, but she sets a great example now. I was also lucky to have a very Christian grandmother (her mother) who, although it didn't have the right impact when I was younger, is a wonderful memory of what I strive to be in my Christian walk.
I really think this time was his "rock bottom". After discovering this site and reading some posts I began to look at the situation differently. I didn't really look at the situation as his being a "sex addict". I know I handled the situation wrong in the past. Just telling him to stop is as effective as telling an alcoholic to not drink. They too are faced with consequences that the desire to drink represses. While we were talking I made a point not to accuse, but calmly asked him questions about his problem. He responded in kind by actually answering these uncomfortable questions. I now think of this as a problem that we need to fight as a team instead of expecting him to handle it alone due to it's dirty nature. There is hope though. Apparently he did stay away from it after the last incident (I can't remember when that was but over a year) but he happened to see some images about a week ago that triggered the response and he was hooked again. I am thankful I discovered it so soon.
On another note, out of curiosity I asked him when his first exposure to porn was. Apparently his father had some and didn't bother to hid it. He must have been very young because his Dad left when he was 7 and he had very little to do with his kids until my H was 18.
Thank you!
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Melissa
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Posted: Sat Apr 21st, 2007 03:39 pm |
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Gaylon,
Suzi describes "Emotional Connection" perfectly! I don't think men would describe it the same because they see and feel things entirely differently. To them it may just be that they finally understand some of the incoherrant babble that always pours forth from their wifes mouth. I think too often a man's brain goes into automatic when his wife starts talking about anything that is sensitive or emotion. If you can somehow prevent that from happening, then you are connecting!
I've read some of your posts. As I said, my husband is a very anti-social person who opens up to no one but me. He doesn't even talk to people most time (gets it from both of his parents and a warped background). He has agreed to Christian counseling (both individually and together) and said he will take advantage of these forums, especially the Accountability one (which is probably best because he is a different person when he writes. He must view writing as "non-communication" because whatever it is that keeps him from talking to people doesn't seem to apply when he is putting it in written form).
Here is my question to you:
Have you encountered any books that would help him. I see that there are a lot out there, but of course the library doesn't carry the majority of them. If he's going to buy a book I want it to be the right one.
Thanks!
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geeky_student
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Posted: Sun Apr 22nd, 2007 05:59 am |
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Hi Melissa, praise God for working on your husband's heart and yours
A lot of people has said that "every man's battle" is good. I have not read it myself yet. I suppose it would be a good one.
God bless! and blessed we all are in Christ! always!
____________________
For God, for her, for my parents, for own good.
tip: when tempted, think of God, think of that special someone you love.
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gaylon
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Posted: Tue Apr 24th, 2007 12:48 am |
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Suzi wrote: LOL!! ......Does that help? Glad you enjoyed the comment... and yes, it helped a whole lot. My wife has said alot the same things to me, but it just wasn't sinking in very well. The whole "trusting her with my emotions" thing is beyond anything I ever would have thought of on my own, or that would ever have made any sense to me. Not that it especially makes sense to me now, but at least I'm getting a better idea of it...
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gaylon
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Posted: Tue Apr 24th, 2007 12:58 am |
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Melissa wrote: ....I think too often a man's brain goes into automatic when his wife starts talking about anything that is sensitive or emotion. If you can somehow prevent that from happening, then you are connecting!.....He must view writing as "non-communication" because whatever it is that keeps him from talking to people doesn't seem to apply when he is putting it in written form). ... Have you encountered any books that would help him... Too true about brain going on automatic. I'll try to remember that..
Writing - same for me. There is more of my heart exposed on this forum, than any other place in the world. Every few days I try to sit down with my wife and show her my posts. It serves to help her see what I'm thinking and feeling, and leads to more talking with her. Much easier for me to write than to talk.
Two books that have been the most influential for me:
Every Man's Marriage - Stever Arterburn (http://www.newlife.com)
Capture Her Heart - Lysa TerKeurst (And, she writes very well about the husband's perspective with a companion book ' Capture His Heart')
Both were eye-openers for me.
Last edited on Tue Apr 24th, 2007 12:59 am by gaylon
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